Chat Room Issues

This evening we had a rather heated discussion in the chat rooms here on JvS. My character was written as a Grey Jedi which is allowed to use both light and dark powers. I mentioned that my character is able to perform some Sith Magic and that set it off. Despite my many attempts to say that my character DOES NOT have IC mastery of this power and has in fact only been able to do very little with it and the fact that I can do anything I want within reason in the main universe and anything at all in a closed RP, those facts did not matter. I had people shove their ideology down my throat and tell me what I can and cannot do with my intelectual property. It was the fact that they think they knew better so they were right and I was wrong and I was to do what they said.

I have been a loyal player on this game since 1.0 and have been around just as long as most of the old guard and I deserve the same damn respect as anyone. I have taken so much Sithspit around here and never said a word but I found those people were nothing short of insulting, hateful and degrading from my point of view and I have had it now and I want action taken against these people.

While pretty much everyone in that chat room was disrespectful, my big problem right here is with just two people, Daven Aaray and Sinistra.

I copied and pasted below as much of the conversation window that had not expired, which unfortunately cut off all of Sinistras comments and think I got rid of most of the posts that were not pertinent to the issue at hand. Everything that I said, at least back as far as I could go, is still in there. I also ran it threw spellcheck before posting it here, simply because I have an issue with poor grammer and spelling.

[quote:17n8i102](22:44:57) Shay Lighttrayn: you know what? kriff you Sin! I have been really nice to you I think
(22:45:02) Sinistra: I'm going to bed because this whole conversation is just stupid on a level that I don't have tequila to compensate for.
(22:45:55) Jair Crawford: The problem is there is so much open to interpretation
(22:46:10) Daven Aaray: Shay. Listen. You want to be a grey Jedi? you CANNOT use any aspect of Sith Magic. If u want to use it, be a Sith
(22:46:48) Daven Aaray: "By those against whom it was used, Sith magic, also called Sith sorcery, was described as the full destructive power of the dark side of the Force."
(22:46:52) Daven Aaray: THERE
(22:47:00) Daven Aaray: that sums it up right there
(22:47:22) Adi: it would be like a Sith saying 'I canz use force LIGHT WALL!!"
(22:47:29) Adi: it doesn├óÔé¼Ôäót happen
(22:47:37) Shay Lighttrayn: yes, when wielded by Darth Zannah, who was a master of Sith magic
(22:48:26) Daven Aaray: SHE WAS A kriff SITH
(22:48:30) Adi: if there was Jedi Magic, I├óÔé¼Ôäód say you would be on the questionable side of ok. but...there -isn├óÔé¼Ôäót- light sided magic of any kind...not like Sith magic
(22:49:14) Aedon Gavin Montrose is starting to think that Shay has efficiently trolled Adult Chat...
(22:49:25) Shay Lighttrayn ignores Daven
(22:49:29) The Holy Man: Can't tell if troll... Or stupid.
(22:49:45) Aedon Gavin Montrose: wait...you're just now finding this out, Danno?
(22:49:47) The Holy Man: Yeah that happened a little bit back Dan
(22:49:48) Daven Aaray: she├óÔé¼Ôäós kriff ignoring me because i'm right
(22:50:05) The Holy Man: You're exactly right Daven
(22:50:10) Daven Aaray: or too ignorant to admit she├óÔé¼Ôäós wrong
(22:50:12) The Holy Man: Nobody is going to argue with that
(22:50:45) Rang Beviin: thank you
(22:50:49) Daven Aaray: I mean for kriff sake how many quotes do I need to put up?
(22:50:55) Adi: shay, bottom line is, I don├óÔé¼Ôäót believe there is an RPer here in any kind of mainstream storyline that would accept that a Jedi of -any- kind, not even a dark Jedi, would use Sith magic.
(22:51:26) Rang Beviin: Dark Jedi maybe
(22:51:33) Rang Beviin: we accepted C'thulu and Hevn
(22:51:34) The Holy Man: Sith Magic. SITH Magic. SITH. Not that hard of a concept.
(22:51:38) Rang Beviin: who both used Sith magic
(22:51:54) The Holy Man: All the DJO members get free passes
(22:51:54) Adi: their characters were also created earlier in JvS's history
(22:52:03) Adi: they were pretty much grandfathered in from 1.0
(22:52:10) Adi: neither one of em use it anymore
(22:52:15) Shay Lighttrayn: Dav, you├óÔé¼Ôäóre an idiot so I'll say it again slowly, I... have... not... mastered... the... power!!! And besides, I can do anything I want in closed RP.
(22:52:25) Daven Aaray: and it takes absolute embracement of the dark side to use
(22:52:43) Daven Aaray: you CANT kriff MASTER IT
(22:52:59) The Holy Man: You can do anything you want, yes. And we can criticize you and try to help you realize you are wrong and try to help you too
(22:52:59) Daven Aaray: you can├óÔé¼Ôäót use it for that matter
(22:53:02) Marshal Yuen: it├óÔé¼Ôäós not like she's saying she's going to try
(22:53:02) Shay Lighttrayn: and I├óÔé¼Ôäóm not trying to you NIT
(22:53:02) Adi: there isn├óÔé¼Ôäót even getting a grasp enough on the power to even begin to use any form of it.
(22:53:09) Marshal Yuen: to master it
(22:53:10) Varro Calistarious: You can do whatever you want in a Closed Storyline
(22:53:17) Adi: daven, shay, please...calm down
(22:53:27) Daven Aaray: a Grey Jedi does not have enough negative emotion to be able to even cast a small spell
(22:54:07) Daven Aaray: wow, a nit? really?
(22:54:42) Daven Aaray: if you are going to insult me you need to do better than that
(22:54:53) Shay Lighttrayn: Adi, this was a civilized conversation. But idiots like Dav and Sin are trying to cram their kriff ideas down my throat, kriff that
(22:55:20) Lamia: Shay, Sinistra has forgotten more about Star Wars than most people know
(22:55:25) The Holy Man: Shay, they aren't cramming their ideas down your throat. They are trying to HELP you and show you that what you claim isn't possible
(22:55:26) Aedon Gavin Montrose: Shay...it's been the general consensus of pretty much this entire kriff room.
(22:55:26) Lamia: she would not tell you something that wasn't true
(22:55:35) Daven Aaray: our kriff ideas? have I been quoting the Wiki all kriff night for no reason?
(22:55:40) Adi: they aren├óÔé¼Ôäót idiots. honestly, it├óÔé¼Ôäós just the fact that no one has taken the time to explain things to you in a civilized manner, and now this has taken off to a lecture on force paths.
(22:55:46) Adi: daven, please....
(22:55:50) Rang Beviin: Sin could teach a class on Sith in her sleep
(22:56:07) Lamia: that she could
(22:56:07) Varro Calistarious: The whole damn chat room├óÔé¼Ôäós shoving the truth down your throat
(22:56:11) The Holy Man: kriff. She could teach a class on Sith if she were dead
(22:56:17) Adi: guys, easy...we need to stop and think that no one has really offered to help...she├óÔé¼Ôäós right.
(22:56:18) Shay Lighttrayn: I don't want to insult you, I don't even want to argue with you. But you are hell bent that you are right and nothing else matters
(22:56:21) Daven Aaray: Adi. I was nice in the beginning. But the ignorance is aggravating
Marshal Yuen: Sin was one badass Sith back in the day. seems like she's up the ante some
(22:56:30) The Holy Man: She'd STILL be a better Sith writer than some of the ones that claim to be on here
(22:56:31) Rang Beviin: Sin could teach more about Sith then I could about mandos
(22:56:39) Lamia: Shay, I write a Sith Sorceress
(22:56:45) Lamia: I know what I am talking about
(22:56:49) Rhel Oross: and I'm a Sith sith
(22:56:54) The Holy Man: This is why I love canon. It├óÔé¼Ôäós open to so much interpretation!
(22:56:57) Lamia: and what I don't know, my best friend, Sin can tell me
(22:57:02) Rang Beviin: and that├óÔé¼Ôäós not an inconsiderable sum of knowledge
(22:57:04) The Holy Man: And facts are optional!
(22:57:08) The Holy Man: I LOVE IT!!!!!
(22:57:09) Aedon Gavin Montrose: Lams should have some basis of knowledge, that's for damn sure...
(22:57:09) Daven Aaray: I├óÔé¼Ôäóm a Sith Sorcerer. I also know
(22:57:29) Lamia: my Sorcery masters were Randall Flagg and Sith'ari Grizz
(22:58:07) Rang Beviin: the best sorcerer's in jvs history
(22:58:33) Adi: Grizz was the best, I feel....tied for first with Flagg.
(22:58:59) Rang Beviin: Flagg was so good at sith magic that he only carried a palm dart shooter as a weapon
(22:59:15) Daven Aaray: Valerian was pretty good as well
(23:02:53) Shay Lighttrayn: you people win, I deleted the kriff power from my profile
(23:03:24) Adi: shay, thank you. We appreciate it.
(23:06:18) Shay Lighttrayn: I will tell you this right now, and this is the last I'll say about the topic. I have been around this site since 1.0 okay, at least as long as some of you, and I deserve the same amount of respect that anyone of you do
(23:07:13) Daven Aaray: yea um Shay. Just cause you are from 1.0 doesn├óÔé¼Ôäót mean jack
(23:07:27) Shay Lighttrayn: no, you should treat others how you want to be treated
(23:07:48) Daven Aaray: 1.0 was, in all sense, completely crazy
(23:09:12) Shay Lighttrayn: Adelle, I did not have a problem until the very end
(23:09:30) Adelle Bastiel: I saw the whole thing Shay
(23:09:43) Adelle Bastiel: You were belligerent and unwilling to listen to anything anyone had to say
(23:11:14) Shay Lighttrayn: well, I am done with this and I apologize to anyone I offended without meaning to[/quote:17n8i102]

The part of the conversation that got cut was that I shared the definition of Sith Magic, the fact that it is intrinsically darksided and that no one who called themselves a Jedi could use Sith magic because of the very nature of the powers. Shay refused to see the point we were making regarding the power, then I called her an idiot. In hindsight, I probably shouldn't have but as I said before I left the room was that the whole conversation was stupid on a level that was mind boggling.

I didn't persist to insult her, I didn't call her further names, and I went to bed. My last post in chat was to everyone who was discussing the nature of Sith magic.

I've been called worse, but Shay, if I have truly offended you that much, I sincerely apologize. Your character is your own intellectual property, however you still have to interact with everyone else in this universe and as last night showed, there are strong opinions and feelings on the Force and it's limitations. My irritation with your stance about your character is not excuse to call you an idiot.

I accept my mistakes and await my punishment from the Whills.

Time to put my two cents in then.

First of all, everyone in the chat room at the time, including Sinistra and myself, tried to help Shay out by explaining Sith Magic and how it works. Due to its deep embrace of the Dark Side and its use of negative emotions, we tried to explain how it couldn't be feasible for a grey jedi to be able to use such a dark power.

It was when she wouldn't listen to a single thing we would say and act like it was our 'beliefs', when the case was we were using information we know about the SW Universe and the aide of the SW wiki.

Now, you the Whills know I am not usually one brought up on charges often, mainly because I know how to stay out of trouble most of the time.

HOWEVER. It gets very difficult staying calm when you are in fact trying to help someone but they basically tell you that you don't know what you are talking about. I did get carried away at the end, that is of course all that is shown down below.

Now of course, considering she has IRed us, I would like to point out her attitude the whole time could have been better.....She was the first person to ever call me a 'Nit'..

[Zauriel]

Friends,

This matter is officially recognized by the Order of The Whills and will be brought forward to the Council for further discussion. We will get back to you all as soon as deliberation has concluded. Seeing that both SInistra and Daven have said their piece, this topic is hereby locked until a decision is reached.


Zauriel

Friends,

After reviewing this IR, it is the Tribunal's belief that all parties involved were, to varying degrees, at fault. In lieu of disciplinary action, the Tribunal would like to remind everyone that insults and name calling are not permitted in chat, and future infractions will be met with more severe punitive measures.

The Tribunal also feels that, given the debate that gave rise to the situation, that there needs to be a clarification on the nature of Sith Magic. Specifically, Sith Magic is accessible only to those Force-sensitives who possess an intrinsic relationship with the Dark Side. A Jedi, obviously, would not have such a relationship with the Dark Side, nor would a Gray Jedi. Gray Jedi have been known to walk the line between the light and dark sides of the Force, but to do so, can not process the necessary intimacy with the Dark Side that would be required for Sith Magic without fully falling to the Dark Side of the Force.

Please note that the proper procedure is to take such matters to the GRPEC first before coming to the Whills with claims such as this.


The Whill Tribunal